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 Post subject: ARMY LIST DISCUSSION: Core, Special & Rare Units
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:50 pm 
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Only "units" discussion here please.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 4:34 am 
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New unit suggestions

RARE

Royal Chariot
Extremely rare and proud creatures the Giant Sea Horses of the Ocean have often been known to act as mounts for Nautican nobility. Over time Nautican Lords were able to train them to act as mounts for royal chariots. Used exclusively in official ceremonies, due to the rarity of trained mounts, it was only after the Chaos Incursions that they assumed a more regular place in the Nautican arsenal. But even here they remain unique and infrequently seen units and remain the sole province of Nautican nobility. Consequently they are crewed only by Nautican Princes or Nobles, and by honored members of the Trident Guard.

Royal Chariot Unit Cost 125pts

Chariot T6 W3 A D6 impact @ S4 AS 4+
Sea Horse Steeds M9 WS4 S3 T4 A2 I5 L8
Crew (Trident Guard) WS5 BS4 S4 A1 I5 L8
Equipment: Scalemail, Spearguns, Sea Tridents

Upgrades: None
Special Rules: May only be fielded in armies whose General is a Nautican Lord or Nautican Hero. If more than one is taken then one must act as a mount for the army General.


-----------

Nautican Bolt-Thrower

Essentially a large spear-gun imbued with Elemental magic these rare machines were developed to counter the demonic creatures of the Chaos incursions, as well as the Kraken who frequently invaded Nautican territory. Very rare few of these weapons still exist as the magical methods used to construct them have been lost. Consequently they are only used in the direst of circumstances.

Nautican Bolt-Thrower Unit Cost 100pts

Crew x 2 (Wave Breakers)
Weapon characteristics: Bolt S6 RNG 40" NO AS - Weapon T6 W3

Special Rules - Crew is Stubborn

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:39 pm 
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Thanks for the suggestions Kiwi, I'll need a while to digest these, I'm on my way to bed shortly so I'll get back to you tomorrow.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 1:07 am 
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Sea-horse chariots have long been part of greek mythology - Poseidon was supposed to have ridden one if that helps any

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:19 pm 
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I like the concepts I'm just not sure if I should implement them or not.

I had originally imagnied the Nauticans to be light in both missile fire and fast moving cavalry type units and strong in special units (sea creatures) and cheap rank and file with one very good combat unit (ie Trident Guard).

I have had to recently compromise on these in the realisation that, from a combat perspective, they are not accomplished enough to make up for their weaknesses in ranged missiles and fast moving cav.

I do like the ideas though so, I'll add the units (I might tweak a couple of things, I like the idea of the bolt thrower being some sort of harpoon) and we'll let the community decide.

Thanks for the input Kiwi.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:16 pm 
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No worries mate :)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:48 pm 
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Hi Kiwi,

I've given it some more thought and I think they're great suggestions and will get into the list. I'll try to update it sometime this Easter weekend (although I have relative round so it won't be until Monday)

I have asked the Nautican artist Gareth to let me know if he can put some artwork together to represent them. Let see if he's interested (fingers crossed) and, if so, what he comes up with.

Keep the ideas coming and thanks for your help,
Sigmar

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 7:10 pm 
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good news Kiwi, the artist (Gareth Pannan) who's providing the artwork said he'd sketch a chariot / bolt thrower and the new character "Vortex"

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 8:41 pm 
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Awesome - happy to be of help

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:39 pm 
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Just some thoughts after play testing yesterday in a couple of 1000pt games

Coral Hunters
Great fun especially for the points cost - using old edition Lizardman skinks for these worked well as they are the perfect size.

Wavebreakers
Good unit but I should have equipped them with Sea Tridents so they could attack in ranks. Think of them as HE Spearmen but with better armour and without the ASF rule.

Zharc
I was using a 40x40mm base for him, which is what my modified LM Cold One character came on and I strongly suspect he should be on something smaller. Otherwise he is a good character but how about a scaly skin save as well as the AS.

Trident Guard
Awesome unit especially with Oceanic Trident. Give them the Protection of Shoal banner and let them rampage across the board. I had them starting at 7 CR before even entering combat - 3 ranks + 1 banner + 1 for warbanner effect on protection of shoal + 1 from outnumber effect from protection of shoal + 1 Siren's special rule. Put them with your Terror causing Prince (equip with Spirit Shroud) and they are just AWESOME

Giant Crabs
Great unit, fear causing, tough and strong. The Granite Crush is just great used it to sit on and squish the Orc Big Boss General - AH HA HA HA - only problem is they are too slow at M4 but the army special rules and Aqua Lore can help with that. The mating pair rule is nasty mine got eternal hatred and frenzy both times. What is their US though?

Nautican Prince
Good but should have Scalemail as standard equipment, e.g., like Dwarf Thanes get Gromil

Lobstrosities
LOVE THEM!!!!!!!! nuff said

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:07 am 
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Thanks for the comments Kiwi,

Before anyone else gets too excited and starts saying the army is "broken" I would like to add that 5 battles have thus far resulted in 5 defeats. Also, even thought other people have spotted the potential of the Trident Guard no one has says it unbalances the army, indeed, in my own battles and small unit skirmishes I have found them somewhat expensive so far.

Kiwi, regarding your points...

Coral Hunters Great fun especially for the points cost - using old edition Lizardman skinks for these worked well as they are the perfect size.

A: Thanks, I like these guys too. A standard, if somewhat weak missile unit.


Wavebreakers
Good unit but I should have equipped them with Sea Tridents so they could attack in ranks. Think of them as HE Spearmen but with better armour and without the ASF rule.

A: Wavebreakers cannot use tridents, you might be looking at an old version of the rules.


Zharc
I was using a 40x40mm base for him, which is what my modified LM Cold One character came on and I strongly suspect he should be on something smaller. Otherwise he is a good character but how about a scaly skin save as well as the AS.

A: I think Zharc is best suited to a 20x20mm base. He's not that powerful in comparison to many other army heroes - but he is cool ;)

A: I agree he needs some sort of armour save, scaly skin (5+) sounds good. I might increase his points very slightly.



Trident Guard
Awesome unit especially with Oceanic Trident. Give them the Protection of Shoal banner and let them rampage across the board. I had them starting at 7 CR before even entering combat - 3 ranks + 1 banner + 1 for warbanner effect on protection of shoal + 1 from outnumber effect from protection of shoal + 1 Siren's special rule. Put them with your Terror causing Prince (equip with Spirit Shroud) and they are just AWESOME


A: Yep agreed, they were always meant to be the "scary" unit to give the enemy something to think about. I don't think they're necessarily awesome though. Check out the rules for the Dark Elves Black Guard and compare them, they are similar but cheaper.


Giant Crabs
Great unit, fear causing, tough and strong. The Granite Crush is just great used it to sit on and squish the Orc Big Boss General - AH HA HA HA - only problem is they are too slow at M4 but the army special rules and Aqua Lore can help with that. The mating pair rule is nasty mine got eternal hatred and frenzy both times. What is their US though?

A: Unit Strength would be per wounds.

A: my personal favourite unit along with trident guard and crest riders.


Nautican Prince
Good but should have Scalemail as standard equipment, e.g., like Dwarf Thanes get Gromil

A: I have left it optional in case we ever need to make a "balancing rule" that is detrimental to using scale mail.


Lobstrosities
LOVE THEM!!!!!!!! nuff said

A: Me too ! But... do I need to make them resolute like Dwarfs so they can always march move ? I'm concerned that a wily enemy could easily stop them from fighting by using flying units to march block.


Thanks very much for your thoughts and comments Kiwi,
Sigmar

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 19, 2009 10:20 pm 
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Yeah resolute on Lobstrosities would be great - and your right the army isnt broken or weak it just hasnt been tested yet and after playing it and working through a number of lists it most definately has potential

Oops tridents with Wavebreakers was a typo I did mean Spears

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:04 pm 
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Made a few tweaks to the units, most notably Trident Guard.

My friend suggested they were somewhat overpriced and after comparison with other "similar" elites, I think he is right.

Points cost down from 15 to 12pts and base size up from 20mm to 25mm

Some other changes too, see the change summary for details:-

naut1.blogspot.com/2008/08/army-list-changes-summary.html

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2009 11:40 pm 
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New "Interceptor" unit added with some very unique attributes:-

Let me know what you think... (see the Nautican blog - Special Units)


Leviathan Charge

The Interceptors are elite warriors who train solely to protect their realm from the denizens, daemons and monstrous creatures of the deep. Their arch foes are the mindless, feral Leviathans which they despise, infact such is the pain in their tourtured souls, Interceptors have now learnt to hate all their enemies.

The Interceptors have mastered a fast, overwhelming assault that has sometimes proved to be enough to deter the onslaught of a Leviathan and send it back to the deep.

When charging all Interceptors, even those in rear ranks, can throw their javelins into the enemy they are attacking. *

* at -1 to hit like units adopting a stand and shoot charge reaction.

When charging, unsaved wounds inflicted by Interceptor javelins count towards combat resolution for the first round of combat.

Javelins can also be used in the usual way during the shooting phase.


Angular Attack

Interceptors are not stupid ! They always attempt to surround any denizen of the deep that they are sent to attack. They adopt a unique attack always charging two adjoining enemy flanks.

When an interceptor unit charges into combat (but not when the interceptors themselves are charged*) it is aligned as usual (with as many models as possible in base to base contact with the enemy unit charged). "Spare" interceptors in rear ranks automatically wrap around the nearest enemy flank fighting the enemy unit on 2 sides**.

* Interceptors lose the initiative when they themselves are charged and they cannot wrap around an enemy's flank in subsequent rounds of combat.

** Any enemy engaged in a flank or rear automatically loses it's rank bonus for the purposes of combat resolution***. Note: this takes precendence over the normal skirmishing rules that state skirmishers do not negate the enemy's rank bonus. In all other respects the normal skirmishing rules apply (eg. the Interceptors do not receive a combat resolution bonus for flank/rear attacks or unit ranks).

*** the interceptor unit must be in base to base contact with all enemies in the enemy flank to benefit from this bonus. When the Interceptors lose models during combat they are removed from any rear rank first and then the enemy's flank.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 09, 2009 11:17 pm 
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Hi guys, has anyone checked out the new Interceptors yet ? I was wondering if they might be under-costed.

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